Planet Minis

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 08:28 PM

After owning a couple chinese pitbikes and wrenching on them I have decided that stock wheel spacers for the SDG/Pitster style wheels need to be reinvented. They are big, they are heavy, and they are a pain in the butt. So I sat down with a caliper and some spacers and this is what I came up with.

Wheel spacers that actually plug into the wheel... like just about every other bike in the world (granted most stick into a seal). They are rough... just mild steel, but they prove that the idea works. The stock bearings are ditched in favor of ones with a bigger I.D. but the same O.D. The stock 15mm axle would be retained. The spacers simply slide into the bearing (no slop with the very tight tolerances they were machined to... almost a press fit but not quite).

You would no longer need 3 hands, or feet, or a helper monkey to put a wheel on a chinese bike. I'm not saying that its THAT difficult to deal with the regular spacers, but c'mon... its a pain none the less.

Ideally, I would like to see them made out of 2 parts pressed together. A "sleeve" of stainless steel that would be just the part that slides into the bearing, and an outer piece made of aluminum to create the correct O.D. while saving on weight and adding the possibility of anodizing.

What do you guys think?

andor · 11-26-2007, 09:00 PM

I think (know) I want a set. Are the finished ones going to be cro-mo or SS?
Where did you get the bearings, are they on par with say Honda, and will they be included? If not just for the sake of product support i'd make sure they are a fairly common size.

dougtrip · 11-26-2007, 09:02 PM

looks good, i like it

magiksc · 11-26-2007, 09:03 PM

Man those are really nice. If I send you a set of bearings and spacers for my x4r think you can whip me up a set?

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 09:07 PM

I have presented the idea to a couple different people as far as production goes. I really need to know if there is a market for them before anything were to happen.

P.S. mods... i'm not selling anything, just sharing an idea with the mini community. If I get them made and sell them.... i will sell them on ebay because being a vendor on this site is crazy

racerx351 · 11-26-2007, 09:08 PM

nice job bro!!!

Z · 11-26-2007, 09:14 PM

G-craft makes these for NSR50 wheels already but they replace the oil seal instead of your design and are for street use. About the same concept.

50rider340 · 11-26-2007, 09:16 PM

yea how much are the g craft ones 150 bucks???

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 09:17 PM

Those are pretty nifty Dan, but like you said it wouldn't work too hot on dirt.

Z · 11-26-2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z

Here's my question for you on your spacers. I can't speak for chinese parts since I don't have any.

Your spacer is taking up ID inside the bearing. Normally, the bearing and the axle are close to the same size. From the looks of the spacer, are you running a different ID on the bearing then stock, or does the chinese bikes really have a much smaller axle then the ID on the bearing?

Nevermind. I reread your original post and it all makes sense.. bigger ID on the bearing.

One thing to consider. Have you seen newbs use a bearing press on wheels, or are people just supposed to hammer the new bearing in as you know they will. Write good instructions!

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 09:24 PM

The stock axle is a 15mm unit. The bearings have a 15mm ID.

My setup uses a bearing with a larger ID than the stock bearing. The part of the spacer that is sandwiched between takes up the slack between the 15mm axle and the new oversized ID bearing.

hitaburmedusty · 11-26-2007, 09:27 PM

Think he said they are larger ID but same OD to compensate for the inner material added.

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 09:28 PM

Dan... I managed to pound my stock bearings out of a SDG wheel with some ease, and tapped the new ones in with a hammer and socket. I could have done it with a press... but I know everybody has a hammer and sockets. Its about a 5 minute job to put the new bearings in.

If somebody is afraid to do it themselves they can just bring the wheel to a bike shop and pay a mechanic to do it?

cyclerider57 · 11-26-2007, 09:32 PM

That's how we setup our flat track bikes for quick rear sprocket changes without having to worry about spacers. We use aluminum though. There really isn't that big of a need for steel as long as they are a good fit in the bearing.

thorwarrior915 · 11-26-2007, 09:33 PM

No worries about the aluminum deforming with the abuse of a dirt appliction Jordan?

Z · 11-26-2007, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thorwarrior915

Dan... I managed to pound my stock bearings out of a SDG wheel with some ease, and tapped the new ones in with a hammer and socket. I could have done it with a press... but I know everybody has a hammer and sockets. Its about a 5 minute job to put the new bearings in.

If somebody is afraid to do it themselves they can just bring the wheel to a bike shop and pay a mechanic to do it?

Write good instructions. If the bearing isn't going in straight, you can kill the races, especially with Chinaluminum. Also, if the bearing isn't seated right, the center spacer will be loose and put load on the bearing. Lots of ways for people to hamfist a set of wheels.

Keep up the good work.

cyclerider57 · 11-26-2007, 09:38 PM

The axle keeps it all packed tight and if it can't move and shift it's difficult to deform it. We've never had any problems. Just from the pics it looks like you have a good lip thickness so I'd give it a go if I were you.

Ask anyone that comes to the garage when I'm working or thinking about a project. I hate steel. For that reason, I may be a little bias. Do what you feel is needed. Weight on minibikes is never really a problem anyway.

PS. To install bearings put them in dry ice or a freezer before hand. With a torch for some heat to the race, the bearings with literally fall in.

Paxracing · 11-26-2007, 09:41 PM

we have use them on speedway bikes for years.

TRT · 11-26-2007, 09:43 PM

You might also want to think about making the I.D. 12mm so that people can use the sdg style hubs/wheels on their 12mm axle forks/swingarms...thats what I have done......
These are the specs:
O.D.=35mm
I.D.15=mm

Alot of the sdg style wheels are now coming with these specs:
O.D.=37mm
I.D.=12mm

I cant find a 37 x 15 bearing anywhere.....So I had to use 12mm axles and make 15mm od spacers for the fork tubes/rear brake mount.....you get the idea...

have you also thought about making the inner spacer to length and going half way into the bearings...the the outer spacer can go into the other half.....Just an idea....I have messed with this crap numerous times and thank god ai have acess to a lathe at work...ha ha
Troy

trailpimp33 · 11-26-2007, 10:16 PM

Looks good, make sure that the sleeve that sits in the bearing covers almost the entire inner bearing surface. Red Barons rear wheel set up used a similar idea but the spacer only sat in the bearing about 2mm. I could trash a set of rear hub bearing in a month easy on my X2R with the 140 BVH motor.

11-26-2007, 08:28 PM	#1 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype After owning a couple chinese pitbikes and wrenching on them I have decided that stock wheel spacers for the SDG/Pitster style wheels need to be reinvented. They are big, they are heavy, and they are a pain in the butt. So I sat down with a caliper and some spacers and this is what I came up with. Wheel spacers that actually plug into the wheel... like just about every other bike in the world (granted most stick into a seal). They are rough... just mild steel, but they prove that the idea works. The stock bearings are ditched in favor of ones with a bigger I.D. but the same O.D. The stock 15mm axle would be retained. The spacers simply slide into the bearing (no slop with the very tight tolerances they were machined to... almost a press fit but not quite). You would no longer need 3 hands, or feet, or a helper monkey to put a wheel on a chinese bike. I'm not saying that its THAT difficult to deal with the regular spacers, but c'mon... its a pain none the less. Ideally, I would like to see them made out of 2 parts pressed together. A "sleeve" of stainless steel that would be just the part that slides into the bearing, and an outer piece made of aluminum to create the correct O.D. while saving on weight and adding the possibility of anodizing. What do you guys think?

11-26-2007, 09:00 PM	#2 (permalink)
andor PM Newbie Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 43	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype I think (know) I want a set. Are the finished ones going to be cro-mo or SS? Where did you get the bearings, are they on par with say Honda, and will they be included? If not just for the sake of product support i'd make sure they are a fairly common size.

11-26-2007, 09:02 PM	#3 (permalink)
dougtrip 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: North East Ohio Posts: 1,954	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype looks good, i like it

11-26-2007, 09:03 PM	#4 (permalink)
magiksc 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Somewhere between Heaven and Hell... Hemet/Provo Posts: 3,685 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype Man those are really nice. If I send you a set of bearings and spacers for my x4r think you can whip me up a set?

11-26-2007, 09:07 PM	#5 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype I have presented the idea to a couple different people as far as production goes. I really need to know if there is a market for them before anything were to happen. P.S. mods... i'm not selling anything, just sharing an idea with the mini community. If I get them made and sell them.... i will sell them on ebay because being a vendor on this site is crazy

11-26-2007, 09:08 PM	#6 (permalink)
racerx351 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,808	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype nice job bro!!!

11-26-2007, 09:14 PM	#7 (permalink)
Z 5th Gear Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: KANSAS Posts: 8,791	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype G-craft makes these for NSR50 wheels already but they replace the oil seal instead of your design and are for street use. About the same concept.

11-26-2007, 09:16 PM	#8 (permalink)
50rider340 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: CT Posts: 3,484 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype yea how much are the g craft ones 150 bucks???

11-26-2007, 09:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype Those are pretty nifty Dan, but like you said it wouldn't work too hot on dirt.

11-26-2007, 09:24 PM	#11 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype The stock axle is a 15mm unit. The bearings have a 15mm ID. My setup uses a bearing with a larger ID than the stock bearing. The part of the spacer that is sandwiched between takes up the slack between the 15mm axle and the new oversized ID bearing.

11-26-2007, 09:27 PM	#12 (permalink)
hitaburmedusty 2nd Gear Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Maui, Hawaii Posts: 245	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype Think he said they are larger ID but same OD to compensate for the inner material added.

11-26-2007, 09:28 PM	#13 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype Dan... I managed to pound my stock bearings out of a SDG wheel with some ease, and tapped the new ones in with a hammer and socket. I could have done it with a press... but I know everybody has a hammer and sockets. Its about a 5 minute job to put the new bearings in. If somebody is afraid to do it themselves they can just bring the wheel to a bike shop and pay a mechanic to do it?

11-26-2007, 09:32 PM	#14 (permalink)
cyclerider57 Got Un-disappeared Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Kansas Posts: 4,329 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype That's how we setup our flat track bikes for quick rear sprocket changes without having to worry about spacers. We use aluminum though. There really isn't that big of a need for steel as long as they are a good fit in the bearing. __________________ The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others. Goodness speaks in a whisper, evil shouts. -Tibetan Proverb

11-26-2007, 09:33 PM	#15 (permalink)
thorwarrior915 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malone, NY Posts: 4,559 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype No worries about the aluminum deforming with the abuse of a dirt appliction Jordan?

11-26-2007, 09:38 PM	#17 (permalink)
cyclerider57 Got Un-disappeared Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Kansas Posts: 4,329 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype The axle keeps it all packed tight and if it can't move and shift it's difficult to deform it. We've never had any problems. Just from the pics it looks like you have a good lip thickness so I'd give it a go if I were you. Ask anyone that comes to the garage when I'm working or thinking about a project. I hate steel. For that reason, I may be a little bias. Do what you feel is needed. Weight on minibikes is never really a problem anyway. PS. To install bearings put them in dry ice or a freezer before hand. With a torch for some heat to the race, the bearings with literally fall in. __________________ The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others. Goodness speaks in a whisper, evil shouts. -Tibetan Proverb Last edited by cyclerider57; 11-26-2007 at 09:43 PM.

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11-26-2007, 09:41 PM	#18 (permalink)
Paxracing 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: ca Posts: 5,754 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype we have use them on speedway bikes for years. Last edited by Paxracing; 11-26-2007 at 09:54 PM.

11-26-2007, 09:43 PM	#19 (permalink)
TRT 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Earth Posts: 2,220 My Mood:	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype You might also want to think about making the I.D. 12mm so that people can use the sdg style hubs/wheels on their 12mm axle forks/swingarms...thats what I have done...... These are the specs: O.D.=35mm I.D.15=mm Alot of the sdg style wheels are now coming with these specs: O.D.=37mm I.D.=12mm I cant find a 37 x 15 bearing anywhere.....So I had to use 12mm axles and make 15mm od spacers for the fork tubes/rear brake mount.....you get the idea... have you also thought about making the inner spacer to length and going half way into the bearings...the the outer spacer can go into the other half.....Just an idea....I have messed with this crap numerous times and thank god ai have acess to a lathe at work...ha ha Troy

11-26-2007, 10:16 PM	#20 (permalink)
trailpimp33 3rd Gear Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,654	Re: check out my wheel spacer invention/prototype Looks good, make sure that the sleeve that sits in the bearing covers almost the entire inner bearing surface. Red Barons rear wheel set up used a similar idea but the spacer only sat in the bearing about 2mm. I could trash a set of rear hub bearing in a month easy on my X2R with the 140 BVH motor.